Catherine West

Catherine West is an Entrepreneurial health care executive who leads highly complex strategic initiatives. Laser-focused on stakeholder engagement, value, and bottom-line results, with a deep commitment to continuously improving consumer experiences and population health. She’s also a CEO and an Independent Management Consultant. She is a proven leader, with experience in the non-profit, philanthropic, research, business, and government sectors. Her strengths include partnership development, operational excellence, and the ability to manage complexity and deliver results.

She is known for her creative, innovative approach to buying and selling properties and refurbishing real estate. Catherine displays exceptional speed, stamina, vision, and devotion to the community.

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Catherine West on Bridging the Connection Between Health Care & Real Estate

Pamela Bardhi
Hello everyone and welcome to another episode of underdog. Today I have a real estate mogul right in front of me here and her name is Catherine. Catherine, how are you?

Catherine West
I’m great Pamela, I’m great.

Pamela Bardhi
Oh, it’s so awesome to have you here today. Katherine, thank you so much for being here. I am so pumped to hear all about your story. Because your background is so diverse. And not just real estate, but in the philanthropic world, like, just so much amazingness that you’ve got and my opening loaded question. What inspired you on the journey to where you are today? loaded question. I know.

Catherine West
That is a very, very loaded question. Very important question. Thank you and thank you for having me on your show. I was really looking forward to being here with you today, I would say what’s inspiring me. Or who’s inspiring me is really my mother. And her encouragement and support growing up and really just encouraged me to keep moving forward. To not let perceived obstacles or barriers get in my way and to really, not only aim high but fly high. And she always encouraged me to fly high and so I try to soar like an eagle and let my light shine every day.

Pamela Bardhi
That’s amazing. And now and like your career trajectory, because it’s been so diverse. First, what did you want to be when you grew up? That’s a question for you. And then we’ll jump into where your career-wise. What would that look like?

Catherine West
That is a very important question. So my career aspiration when I was five years old, was to work at cappuccinos so that I could get free pizza every day for lunch.

Pamela Bardhi
That’s amazing. So take it you love pizza just as much as I do, if not more.

Catherine West
Yeah, yes. And I realized that career aspiration when I was at college and worked in a pizza shop, and became a manager.

Pamela Bardhi
Awesome. That’s amazing, I love pizza. I could talk about pizza all day and never get sick of it. My parents have had the restaurant since I was 10. So like, I never get sick of it, I don’t know how I don’t know why. But I could eat it all day, I eat like a child. That’s what I do. Seriously, that’s amazing. And now cuz your career has pivoted several times to get you where you are today. So like, what did you start off in first, like, you know, in high school, going to college. Walk me sort of through that process and what you were thinking then and what led you down your path at that time?

Catherine West
Yes, I would say I am a tapestry, Pamela and many lived experiences. And really, which made me who I am today. So I started off in health care and that journey took me. Through for-profit, nonprofit government philanthropy. Really trying to understand how different sectors view communities, how they view problems, how they view solutions. So always seeking to understand and always seeking to understand from the other person’s or the other stakeholders point of view.

And to figure out how can we collaborate. How can we tackle and address some of our hairiest healthcare problems that persist as inequities to this day. And so I love being that connector and bringing together different sectors, different stakeholders, to create solutions. I’m very much an out of the box, type person and love bringing different groups of folks together to create sustainable change.

Pamela Bardhi
That’s amazing. So like, What led you down that route? Like in the healthcare space, you know, in the beginning. Was there a particular person that influenced you or like some experience that led you down that path?

Catherine West
It was really my mother and growing up, she was a visiting nurse. And I was able to go with her to some of her patients’ homes, particularly around the holidays. Where she would give out Christmas presents. And so seeing how different communities particularly single mom, teenage single moms lived and watching my mom try and support them. Not only in terms of health care but just holistically.

She would read the police log at night and the obituaries at night checking on her patients and their families in the community. And so seeing her embrace of the community is really what led me down the path of public health. How can we create sustainable change in the community? So broader than patient by patient, so that the change outlives me and makes our long-term lasting difference.

Pamela Bardhi
Amazing. And then through healthcare, you pivoted to real estate? So like, how did that transition happen? That inspiration happen?

Catherine West
Yes, quite a pivot, pretty unusual and unique. I think I was inspired by a few things. One inspired by everybody’s favorite uncle, Rich Dad, Poor Dad. Who really opened my eyes to the power of real estate and the power of thinking and the power of creating a legacy. And how you can create generational change, too. I graduated from grad school in August of 08 and a job and so started consulting. But all of a sudden, eyes wide open to the larger economy. Whereas before Joomla hadn’t been paying that much attention to the larger economy and what was going on. And so that experience forever made me a proponent of real estate and real estate investing.

Instead of candidly stock market investing as a way for folks to reach not only financial freedom,. But I’m very much a proponent of financial happiness, thanks to one of my mentors, George Anton. So those two I think pivoting moments is what started me down the path of real estate and real estate investing. And really believing that everybody needs a clean, safe and affordable place to live. Bringing with me my social justice to real estate investing. Wanting to understand the unspoken rules in real estate and how wealth is built.

And Captain America and share those unspoken rules, particularly with women, people of color. Immigrants from a social justice lens to really shape ultimately, families, communities, and generations. And so that inquiry has also brought me down the line in real estate across multiple asset classes, multiple geographies. Short and long-term debt positions and equity positions and so at this point. I have this rich real estate experience as well, too, and ultimately speak many. Many languages between healthcare and real estate and working with so many great amazing people and stakeholders throughout my career.

Pamela Bardhi
I love that, so in the healthcare space. Because oftentimes, like, when you think about health care like I just think about doctors and nurses. So like, and you’re talking about this bigger picture change in the healthcare world, so like with that. Can you elaborate a little bit about what that is to the outside person who’s not thinking how health care can truly change and transform. Like you’re saying basically. What you’re working on in that realm to create that change?

Catherine West
Sure, sure. I guess I would say, ultimately, you can map poverty and you can map disease. And certain communities are disproportionately impacted by different health conditions and certainly, COVID brought that to light. So by focusing on clean, safe, and affordable housing, clean, healthy, happy communities. That has reverberating effects on individuals, health, and their health outcomes. And as well as their ultimate empowerment and resiliency and so for me, it’s a way to create sustainable change. Because if you can transform a neighborhood, you can ultimately transform our community and impact positively future generations.

Pamela Bardhi
Right. And what’s really interesting is this is epigenetics by Dr. Bruce Lipton. That was fascinating about what you’re saying is like your environment can alter your DNA positively or negatively. So you’re saying that your environment is linked to your health conditions. Which is crazy to think about, so like, and I’ve noticed that in lower-income areas, diabetes is through the roof. Cancer is through the roof. And it’s like, it all makes sense. Because if you look at our food system in America, anything with lots of sugars is always cheap. Anything that’s supposed to be good for you and organic is always so much more expensive. And it’s like, even within our food system that lie.

So it’s fascinating to see, like, there is a whole magnitude of picture here. And like the real estate portion, like. I’m kind of not surprised you got into that realm because it ties together so nicely. But a lot of people wouldn’t think that healthcare and real estate go hand in hand. By creating a positive environment, you can alter somebody’s DNA to live a better life. Which is nuts, like, it’s mind-blowing, you’re like what? Like, that exists, right? Because a lot of people don’t think that these things correlate, which I think is so cool. Did you have like an aha moment where you realize you’re like, hold up, this is intertwined, right?

Catherine West
Yes, I certainly always knew that from the healthcare space, if you will. But it was stepping into the housing space and seeing the possibilities and the opportunities. That really sharpened that for me and kind of made it more clear. For how I can move forward on my vision, my goals, and support others as well, too. Yes. And to your point is oftentimes very invisible. We don’t necessarily always think about the intersections. I would say that we each have more power individually than we realize we do, I can use that power to create some really cool things, positive outcomes.

Pamela Bardhi
What are some of the patterns that you’ve seen throughout your healthcare experience, what are some major indicators that you’ve seen. That alarms you and you’re like, Oh, my God. I want to create healthy, affordable, sustainable housing.

Catherine West
I think it’s really just a great question. But going to where people, patients live, work and play and I was fortunate. If you will to get outside of the four walls of a hospital or a clinic. And do some really innovative work to reach people where they live, work, and play to provide health care. Recognizing that some people will never access traditional health care. And so through my work at Gilead, sciences to address HIV and disparities in HIV testing, and screening and ultimately access.

We were able to create some amazing pilots and partner with local partners like the DMV, in ward seven and eight in Washington, DC. Or whenever it goes across the river. And really just do some amazing partnerships to reach people where they live, work, and play. So I think that experience in particular really opened my eyes to the power of what we say in healthcare. The built environment and how that can impact an individual’s health.

Pamela Bardhi
Wow. That’s so fascinating. It’s just to me like it blows my mind how they actually are super connected. Because it’s just like, they just seem like polar opposite worlds to me. Even like before you start speaking on, like, health care. And then I was like, and then I just thought about the epigenetics and I’m like, Well, yeah. Cuz your DNA is altered by your environment and the people you surround yourself with. Like when they say your net worth is based on the people that you surround yourself with, which is so nuts. But there’s actual scientific proof now that it does alter and it couldn’t predetermine health conditions based on your location.

And really all of that, which is just mind-blowing, throughout your experiences. Because you’ve navigated the healthcare world. You’ve also navigated the real estate world, as a woman and also as woman of color. So like your experiences throughout the process? What was that like throughout in both industries, if you will. Because I’ve experienced it on the real estate side as a female immigrant if you will. But everyone’s experiences are different. So I’d love to hear really all about you. And how you how you navigated through both,

Catherine West
Yes, it’s certainly been a journey as a woman. A woman of color and a young woman of color. So if you get the other component, because particularly when you’re a leader, oftentimes you’re pushing. You’re the first and you’re perhaps the only in the room. And so having the confidence to speak up and put yourself out there, to at least have the courage to do that. Takes a lot and I certainly experienced that, probably throughout my entire life in healthcare and housing. Typically, I would say a little bit more on the real estate side. Just because it is so male-dominated and you can’t be shy about being a female investor and developer in a networking room.

Where 95% are men or the women who come are just sometimes supportive partners but not the active investor herself. And so not only having the confidence to speak up. But also connect with and support other women is huge for me. Because I know that there are a lot of women who want to get into real estate, investing, and development. But aren’t sure how women work better in teams, just like how WMBA illustrates. You know, pass the ball a lot more and we work better and teams. So what does that look like in the real estate space? And how can we support each other as well, so that everybody wins?

Pamela Bardhi
Yeah, for sure and there were some experiences. Throughout the way that were challenging for you as you were navigating through. Because I know every story has its ups down sideways. So I decided all that and I always talk about it, like when I first started the first three to five years of real estate development. It was like, No, everyone looks at me now. And they’re like, wow, bam, you sold, developed. Or acquired over 100 mil in the last eight years and you’re 29 years old and you’re licensed. You see it and you do this and then I’m like, yeah. That’s all hustle.

But like in the beginning, the first three to five years were like. I was literally racking my brains and racking up my credit cards while I was at it. Because I was so ambitious and I wanted to do so much. That I wasn’t like financially forecasting. Like cash flow, as well as I should have been dealing with two restaurants plus, doing my flips and everything like that. So I put myself in a bad position sometimes and messed up my credit a little bit. You know, like, there’s all these experiences that we go through our careers.

And through our journeys that like, eek, that wasn’t like the greatest thing. But it’s were some of your biggest if you will. I don’t like to say failures, I like to say lessons that you really learned. Throughout your trajectory and how you overcame them. Because I know there’s people listening that may be going through something similar right now. And helping them navigate through that hump is always the most important. So I’d love to hear

Catherine West
Yes, absolutely. Absolutely and I agree because I don’t look at them as failures, only just lessons. So it’s almost hard for me to think of things that didn’t go right. Because they almost always translate into lessons in my brain, if you will. But yes, everything from learning about the importance of state law. And how that plays out and everything from evictions to non-performing notes and really understanding, okay. I’ve got to learn state law, wherever I’m operating. Because I’ve made some mistakes, not understanding investing in a new state. Or without understanding the full ramifications and whether it’s a landlord-friendly or a tenant-friendly state.

I would say that’s probably one important lesson that I’ve learned over my career. Another lesson learned is around inaction and taking, you know. Lots of great, amazing real estate education classes and then not doing anything with them. Which I know is a common one. But I think it’s real and one of the things that helped me get over that inaction was just connecting with other investors. And following up and having a business partner and ultimately that business partner didn’t work out. Which I guess one could say is a failure, but through life brought me to my current business partner. And we work really well together and I for my business, even more. Because of our collaboration and business partnership than alone.

Pamela Bardhi
Yeah, so it was in the real estate partnership that you were mentioning that. And then the first time I just wanted to backtrack. In terms of landlord-friendly and pet friendly. Just so, anybody who’s listening, that’s not in real estate. I mean, there’s such a thing as states that basically have policies that are driven towards the landlord. And then there’s some that have policies driven towards the tenant. So Massachusetts, for example, is a tenant-friendly state.

So FYI, anyone who’s listening, so basically anyone who’s doing investment. Very important to know that, especially in multifamily, so I just wanted to backtrack. So they knew what exactly was the amount with pet-friendly and tenant-friendly. And then the partners, real estate partners. I mean, those are lessons right there. My God. I’ve had my fair share with that, too. At the beginning when you first start. You don’t have the experience and you do have partners into the mix and like, you know. How do you navigate through that when things aren’t going so great? And how did you sort of handle that?

Catherine West
I mean, so I guess the first step was I’m glad I didn’t formally partner reach at our own entities. Because a business partnership or relationship is very close to if you were to get married with someone. As soon as you co-mingle within that same entity. It’s really hard to unquote mingle if you will. So I’m so glad that you know. Despite the first business partnership not working out, at least, it wasn’t a long-term ramification.

Because we had each maintained our own individual entities. So that would be one big piece of advice and then with my current work business, right. I know each still has their own individual entities and corporations, but collaborate. A lot of projects have weekly business meetings. You know, agendas, but importantly quarterly goals, annual goals that we’re driving towards. Yeah. So

Pamela Bardhi
Tell me about how you work with your own entity into a partnership. I know that there’s a lot of people listening that don’t know that it can even exist. Because I think that’s so important that you can still affiliate with someone on a business level. But you’re still separate, which I think is really, really key because I feel like a lot of people. Make the same mistake of commingling and getting into one entity with multiple partners. So how if you could share how you did that? Because that’s huge.

Catherine West
Sure. I mean, I appreciate that question, I guess I would say for us. It was really just at first testing the waters and making sure that we are aligned. Philosophically aligned in terms of our values, aligned in terms of execution, and aligned in terms of goals. And so have grown our business partnership over time, to this day. Where we’re now having weekly meetings and agendas and minutes and action items and running very much in sync. But as an entity perspective, still very separate on the back end.

Pamela Bardhi
Just so basically, you can go enter into a deal with two entities. That’s possible. Interesting. And you lay that out and like the operating agreement on how that works.

Catherine West
I guess it depends on what type of everything you’re talking about. Because certainly as there’s different partnerships. Where five individuals could be five different entities coming together. To purchase an asset and a small-scale equity partnership, if you will, for an individual asset. And those five entities may be part of a larger LLC for that one asset. But then that’s different than two corporations coming together.

Pamela Bardhi
A lot of people don’t know that you can do that, so that’s why I like. How do you do it? So thinking sort of like figure out like, okay, yeah, this is possible don’t come mingle with anybody else. Use your own entity, because also you’re protected by business liability at that point, too. When you’re using your entities. That’s brilliant. You mentioned a mentor. Was it George And Tom?

Catherine West
Yes, George Anton, yes.

Pamela Bardhi
So tell me about him, like. How did you meet him? Like, how did it all sort of come together? Between you two? And then like. What inspired you about them?

Catherine West
Yes, I was inspired by George. Because he is one of the nicest, humblest people that I’ve ever met. And you would never know that, he’s so accomplished and has done all of these amazing real estate transactions and really achieved a lot in his life. He’s just super relatable and caring and wants to make sure that I’m successful and that each person that he mentors is successful and that he supports is successful. And so it’s really that humility, coupled with desire to make a difference was really inspiring for me and so through George. I learned and ultimately embraced the concept of financial happiness. Which takes Robert Kiyosaki premise of financial freedom to a step further.

And so financial freedom is where you have enough passive income coming in to replace your two-income, as many people had to define it. So that you don’t have to, quote-unquote, work in your two jobs. But financial happiness takes it a step further and really flips it and it becomes about your life, and what is your ideal life? Because oftentimes, we’re just so busy doing and then we look back, and there’s our life. But what does it mean to proactively create your life and what do you want out of life and what’s important to you? And for me working out and yoga and Zumba and walking and seeing family and friends and going to the beach?

Then how do you then shape your business, your company, your revenue streams. To achieve your ideal life that’s important to you. So just totally flipped the switch instead of starting with the business? And then there’s your life? How do you create the life that you want and then use the business to create that life? So I’m a big proponent of financial happiness and working with others. Working with my clients to really understand what’s important to them and why we are here on earth and life is short. And I’m just really a big proponent of soaking it all up and making the most of our time here.

Pamela Bardhi
Right. And I think the most precious gifts this time like you said, it’s like. If your income can be replaced, like what else would you do? Like I always ask people, if you didn’t have to worry about money, what would you be doing? Seriously? What would you be doing, If it wasn’t for the money? If you had something that replaced your income? Like, what would you be doing? And they’re like, that’s possible? Yes, totally and real estate is like, one of the very few vehicles that I know. That has the potential to leverage your life that way, where you make money when you sleep, right rental income.

Catherine West
For me, it’s a combination of likely traveling and traveling around the world internationally. Because I love to travel and meet new people, meet new cultures and just soak it all up, likely serving on a few boards. And likely still doing real estate because I love real estate and so I think. I would still be doing that on the side, so to speak, because it’s just so much fun.

Pamela Bardhi
That’s awesome. So going from like healthcare to real estate, which are like two different parallel worlds, if you will. And you still find a way to balance both. How did you integrate real estate in such a way, because a lot of people. I feel like they are so afraid to take the jump to the next level of their career to want to diversify. Because they feel like oh, well, I have a full-time job. Like I can’t possibly get involved in this. And like with real estate, I’ve always told people like, you can be as active and as passive as you possibly want. You choose. So how were you able to sort of integrate that into your own life?

Catherine West
Yes, no, that’s a great, great question. A great point for many years was healthcare by day, real estate by night. And living two dual lives parallel lives where they did not intersect. If you lm poorly, it was a little bit of concern for my two employers. Would think that I’m not giving my all to the two jobs if I knew I was doing real estate and just kind of navigating those spaces. So it’s not till recently, if you will, that I’ve been able to combine the two and leverage the two and realize what a unique skill set I have.

And instead of hiding my light, really embraced it and combined the two to be even more powerful. So that’s really the journey that I’m on now is continuing to combine leverage and exponentially grow the two together. And so that’s taken me more into the affordable housing space into addressing homelessness and housing insecurity and really bridging the gaps. Between housing and health care and not only for me as a person. But for the two sectors themselves and bringing together the stakeholders to create those solutions together.

And so, to your question about how much you wanted to get involved in real estate, I couldn’t agree more. Because there are many folks who want to get involved in real estate. And the advice is, you know, don’t make it a hobby, treat it like a job, which is very true. But I also believe not everybody needs to be a full-time active real estate investor. Because a lot of work that’s fighting off a lot.

Pamela Bardhi
I can tell you first, like, run to the site, this craziness, the madness going on here. Oh, we got to replace all the plumbing here. It’s like you know, getting the calls from the plumber. So yeah, it can be as active and as passive as you possibly want. Which is so important to notate, so important.

Catherine West
Yes. And I think you know and it’s been an event that has taken me on a journey from active to passive and across asset classes and across geographies and it is a journey. Because you’re figuring out what’s important to you. What is your ideal life and I think being a passive investor can be just as powerful because then you’re still having your money work for you. But you’re not focused on the day in day out of an active project.

And as wonderful as real estate is, there’s certainly risk involved and you need to work with people. Who knows what they’re doing and I’ve seen a lot of I’ve made mistakes and I’ve seen a lot of mistakes. Or people may sign up online to participate in a real estate project. But they’re not really protected because the way it’s set up, it’s not in a separate LLC. And so you can lose in real estate as well too. So it’s always helpful to dip your toe in the water or start small, learn and grow from there. Yeah,

Pamela Bardhi
Yeah, find your sandbox, I say because I dabbled in so much. And I was like what were my biggest strengths and it’s like, mine is development. But then I also love adding value to people. So it’s like on the brokerage side I can also help on that ends what I like to keep it exclusive. I don’t like to work with everyone because that just gets crazy. I’m training my team when I get my team that I like fully.

Could execute exactly the same as I can meaning out there on the marketplace in terms of active listings and stuff like that, then then I’m like. Okay, I’ll bet they can replicate me other than that. It can get super tricky, but it’s like finding your sandbox and like where your strengths are, where your weaknesses are. How active, how passive you want to be. Which I think is so cool. So so cool. What would be like your biggest tip in real estate would you say based on your experience so far?

Catherine West
Gosh, I would say to not be afraid to ask questions.

Pamela Bardhi
Real Estate has its own language. I like to say so Questions are very big. Because Really? What’s that? You’ll find yourself on Google a lot. If you’re like, getting in the real estate game in any space within real estate, especially investment side.

Catherine West
Exactly and so do not feel dumb to ask a question. When you’re talking with someone, project and put yourself out there

What Would Catherine Older Self Tell Her Younger Self

Pamela Bardhi
And like, you know, based on your experience in both worlds. And I love that you’ve culminated them together in such a beautiful and harmonious way. In ways that people would never think that they coexist so much between real estate and healthcare. What would your older self tell your younger self based on what you know now. It could be business, could be personal, whatever.

Catherine West
It would certainly be to invest more earlier, kind of speaking to that period of inaction that I referenced earlier. And to not be afraid to move forward one to two to connect with other, like, minded individuals and to stay in touch with them. Because those folks, individuals, friends, business partners are really what keep you going. Sharing ideas and synergies is super powerful because it opens up new possibilities and opportunities. That you may have not seen or may have not been aware of or know of. So really, just connecting with people is huge. I love that. And like Katherine, what are you up to in your world? Now?

Pamela Bardhi
What’s coming up and like the next 12 months for you? Would you say what’s on the horizon?

Catherine West
Every day? I’m full of differently, but gotta love it, right? Yes, yes, in general, I would say that. So right now, I am excited because we’re gonna be serving as a general partner for an upcoming project in Boston. Which I’m really excited as a female investor and investor of color to really be in that leadership role. And being really intentional about what I’m creating and I’m proud to say. That the majority of our debt and equity partners are people of color and immigrants. I’m proud to say that our contractors and subs are people of color, I’m proud to say that we’re investing in Dorchester.

And so just really like a potentially radical shift. If you look at how wealth is built and Captain using Boston as the example since that’s our current home base. But as many folks know, the seaport and other areas were created by those that had wealth and ultimately. They were able to keep their wealth and grow their wealth. So for me, it’s a form of social justice. And that’s why I say we each individually have power. We may not realize how much power we each individually have. But it’s small actions and decisions that you can create something that’s really meaningful and really powerful and helps on so many different levels.

So for me, I’m excited to step into this. Or I am in this gap leadership role and to continue to build on that momentum with additional projects. Investing in the community and similarly, supporting and getting opportunities to invest where people may not usually have that opportunity. And same on the contracting side and I say that. Because it’s interesting to me in the larger environment right now. There’s different funds that are popping up like DNI funds for investors of color in particular from an equity perspective. They want to reach more people of color and but it’s interesting to me.

Because these are institutional funds or just larger funds, which to me seemed more disconnected to from the community if you will and to meaningful that change. And I think it’s pretty powerful that yes, we can Sammer women-owned minority-owned. We’re investing in the community, we care, we’re going to create clean, safe, and affordable housing. So really just living in that leadership, intersection role, and then continuing on healthcare and housing side of my consulting practice. And working with affordable housing providers to bridge that gap, if you will. May not speak healthcare with fluency at a healthcare provider to bridge that gap to create a solution. Solutions on the affordable housing, homelessness, and housing security space as well.

Pamela Bardhi
That’s so exciting. I’m pumped to see what you create in the future to be completely honest like I think. It’s going to be so remarkable and if you’re incorporating some really amazing elements. Like healthcare, real estate, social justice inequalities, and really like merging them into one. Which is so cool and like I know you’re going to like, take that and replicate it and just crush it with that. So that’s super exciting. Oh, man, Catherine, you’re amazing. And now like where Can everybody find you? Any social media, email, whatever. Whatever you want to share?

Catherine West
Thank you for that one. And my email is catherine@43 westproperties.com and I always love connecting with new folks. Wherever they are in their journey, whatever they’re thinking about, however, I can be helpful. Because I believe we’re all in this together and we’re better and stronger together. The more that we collaborate and support each other.

Pamela Bardhi
Thank you so much, Catherine. It was such an honor having you here today. So thank you for your time. I’m pumped to see what you create in the future. Thank you.

Tune in to the episode to hear the rest of my incredible interview with the amazing Catherine West.